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| Marshall Member Joined Feb 7, 2002 1191 posts Location: Langley, BC |
 1 Corinthians 5: on sexual immorality |
Posted Sep 8, 2005; 2:54 am |
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1 Corinthians 5 (ESV):
Sexual Immorality Defiles the Church
1 It is actually reported that there is sexual immorality among you, and of a kind that is not tolerated even among pagans, for a man has his father's wife. 2 And you are arrogant! Ought you not rather to mourn? Let him who has done this be removed from among you.
3 For though absent in body, I am present in spirit; and as if present, I have already pronounced judgment on the one who did such a thing. 4 When you are assembled in the name of the Lord Jesus and my spirit is present, with the power of our Lord Jesus, 5 you are to deliver this man to Satan for the destruction of the flesh, so that his spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord.
6 Your boasting is not good. Do you not know that a little leaven leavens the whole lump? 7 Cleanse out the old leaven that you may be a new lump, as you really are unleavened. For Christ, our Passover lamb, has been sacrificed. 8 Let us therefore celebrate the festival, not with the old leaven, the leaven of malice and evil, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
9 I wrote to you in my letter not to associate with sexually immoral people -- 10 not at all meaning the sexually immoral of this world, or the greedy and swindlers, or idolaters, since then you would need to go out of the world. 11 But now I am writing to you not to associate with anyone who bears the name of brother if he is guilty of sexual immorality or greed, or is an idolater, reviler, drunkard, or swindler -- not even to eat with such a one. 12 For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? 13 God judges those outside. "Purge the evil person from among you."
Scripture quotations are from The Holy Bible, English Standard Version, copyright © 2001 by Crossway Bibles, a division of Good News Publishers. Used by permission. All rights reserved.
Introductory questions
These are just to spur thinking on this chapter; feel free to ask your own questions or post comments unrelated to these.
- Why do you think the Corinthian church was guilty of some sins even the unsaved Gentiles didn't commit (verse 1)?
- Based on verses 1-2, are you surprised by how Paul started the letter in 1 Corinthians 1:4-9?
- What does it mean to deliver a person "to Satan for the destruction of the flesh" (verse 5)? How would this ensure that such a person is "saved in the day of the Lord"?
- Does Paul's authority in verses 3-5 have a present-day equivalent, or did that type of authority pass away with the apostles?
- In verse 7, Paul says they are to do something to become something that they already are. What does this mean, and how does it relate to salvation and sanctification?
- Were the Corinthians arrogant and boasting about their sexual misconduct, their toleration of such, or something else?
- Is the festival in verse 8 the Passover, the Lord's supper, or something purely metaphorical? Check this verse in the NASB or NKJV. How many kinds of leaven are there, and what are they?
- Why do you think the first letter to the Corinthians alluded to in verse 9 did not become a part of the New Testament?
- Have you ever eaten with a brother or sister who is guilty of greed (verse 11)? Since taking this verse too literally would probably lead to all believers eating alone, how should it be applied instead?
- How does verse 12 fit with 1 Corinthians 2:15; 4:3-5?
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| Sudsy Member Joined Sep 23, 2003 2833 posts |
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Posted Sep 20, 2005; 6:44 pm |
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Somehow I got involved with various Bible studies at one time but I'll give some attempt on answering the first 6 questions.
1. Why do you think the Corinthian church was guilty of some sins even the unsaved Gentiles didn't commit (verse 1)?
I suspect that the pagans in the Corinth area had a norm of righteous living that would not tolerate such a sin. I think the early church and today's church also will at times, abuse the liberty we now have in Christ. Other religions will sometimes reflect higher standards of righteousness than we when we do not follow God's standards.
2. Based on verses 1-2, are you surprised by how Paul started the letter in 1 Corinthians 1:4-9?
No. Although we are called to be holy 1:2, we will not be blameless until we see Christ and become like Him. It was His faithfulness, not ours that got us our perfected position.
3. What does it mean to deliver a person "to Satan for the destruction of the flesh" (verse 5)? How would this ensure that such a person is "saved in the day of the Lord"?
Deliver the person - break fellowship for the overall good. I believe this Christian would be better off physically dead than to continue being this type of example. I believe Ananias and Sapphira is another example, as perhaps were those spoken of in 1 Cor 11:30 that forfeited their physical lives prematurely due to disobedience or lack of reverence. I believe this is still happening today.
4. Does Paul's authority in verses 3-5 have a present-day equivalent, or did that type of authority pass away with the apostles?
If it passed away, what scripture do we have to support this conclusion ?
5. In verse 7, Paul says they are to do something to become something that they already are. What does this mean, and how does it relate to salvation and sanctification?
I believe at salvation we have the righteousness of Christ, inputed or credited to us putting us 'in Christ'. We are then viewed by God as perfect and qualified for heaven. However, our walk of holiness or sanctification that we are called to pursue is an on-going process that conforms us into the image of Christ. I don't believe we ever permanently reach that state of perfectedness in our experience until we see Christ when we shall become like Him at that time.
6. Were the Corinthians arrogant and boasting about their sexual misconduct, their toleration of such, or something else?
I don't think so. Perhaps they were boasting about this individual for other reasons and were overlooking this flaw. Or perhaps, with so many spiritual gifts in operation, perhaps they were a proud church.
Well, sorry, that is all I have time for at the moment with these quick responses but I would like to hear what others believe on these and the remaining questions. |
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| gay lynn voth Member Joined Jan 25, 2005 693 posts |
| Amen |
Posted Sep 21, 2005; 9:17 am |
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I don't have time to respond more fully but I did want to say how much I appreciated your responses, Sudsy ... When I read the questions earlier, I thought about how I might respond - Reading your thoughtful replies this morning blessed me and led me to offer a hearty "Amen" ...  |
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| Marshall Member Joined Feb 7, 2002 1191 posts Location: Langley, BC |
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Posted Oct 18, 2005; 4:49 am |
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Boy, I really asked a lot of questions about this chapter. I'm going to try and answer or at least comment on the remaining ones.
4. Does Paul's authority in verses 3-5 have a present-day equivalent, or did that type of authority pass away with the apostles?
This one I was quite curious about and hoping to get some feedback on. If it didn't pass away, then who has that authority now? Has it passed from the apostles personally to their writings compiled in Scripture? I guess that's reasonable, but of course we have to discern how Scripture speaks to an issue ourselves, whereas Paul was personally speaking to specific issues in specific churches, such as how to deal with that one man in verses 1-5. I don't see our present-day equivalent of that.
7. Is the festival in verse 8 the Passover, the Lord's supper, or something purely metaphorical? Check this verse in the NASB or NKJV. How many kinds of leaven are there, and what are they?
My guess is that the festival is something purely metaphorical and not a reference to the Lord's supper. This was yet another case where I was surprised to see the amount of ambiguity in the text. In some versions the old leaven is the "leaven of malice and wickedness", while in others there is the old leaven, the leaven of malice and wickedness, and the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth. I really don't know which is correct, but if the festival is metaphorical, it would follow that there are only two kinds of leaven. If it's a reference to the Passover, then the division into three types is probably correct. This passage is a vivid example of how the interpretational choices translators make affect the meaning we get from it. All the more reason to read from more than one translation.
8. Why do you think the first letter to the Corinthians alluded to in verse 9 did not become a part of the New Testament?
The easy answer is because it wasn't inspired. God has preserved everything he wants us to have, and that letter wasn't part of it. I guess the challenge to that is the example of the lost book of the Law found during Josiah's reign, presumably Deuteronomy (2 Kings 22:8-20). This book wasn't rejected as Scripture even though it lacked widespread use prior to its rediscovery. (There's also a widespread hypothesis that the ink in this book was still wet when it was "discovered" by Hilkiah, but that's another issue.) In any case, I doubt the church will ever have to deal with the discovery of this book, and I trust the church made the right decisions with the other books that cropped up early in its history.
9. Have you ever eaten with a brother or sister who is guilty of greed (verse 11)? Since taking this verse too literally would probably lead to all believers eating alone, how should it be applied instead?
Yes, and even eating alone would force me to eat with someone who is occasionally guilty of that. I think the point of this passage is to avoid condoning the willful repeated sinful behaviour of a fellow believer. I think Paul is quite obviously exaggerating to underscore his point.
10. How does verse 12 fit with 1 Corinthians 2:15; 4:3-5?
The "you" in verse 12 is plural, so the church collectively is to judge those within the church. Believers are not subject to any person's judgement, but they are subject to the judgement of the church (2:15). 4:3-5 is speaking of people's independent judgement and not the church's judgement. At least, that's the way I reconcile them. |
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| Sudsy Member Joined Sep 23, 2003 2833 posts |
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Posted Oct 18, 2005; 8:12 am |
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This is one passage that I really appreciate the Message Bible interpretation. I'm not always a big supporter of this version but I think the context here is well supported.
With regard to Paul's authority having present day equivalent, I don't see in scripture where there is indication that this authority has changed any. I believe Mark 16:17 & 18 is still in effect and Paul wants us to be imitators of Christ as he follows Christ. However, I believe it is the Holy Spirit that guides in the use of this authority to cause what God wills to happen and it is not something that any Christian can use at their own discretion like the 'name it and claim it' teachings seem to suggest. |
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| Marshall Member Joined Feb 7, 2002 1191 posts Location: Langley, BC |
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Posted Oct 18, 2005; 3:35 pm |
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Hi Sudsy,
Do you mean that all believers have this authority? |
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| Sudsy Member Joined Sep 23, 2003 2833 posts |
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Posted Oct 18, 2005; 5:07 pm |
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| Well without getting into the supporting scriptures I will state my belief on this. Yes, I believe when we accept Christ into our lives we then have Christ in us in the person of the Holy Spirit and we therefore have His authority over Satan who was defeated at the cross. However, I believe the power of the Holy Spirit to take authority over the strongholds of Satan is operational in Christians who are filled (under the control and infuence of) with the Spirit. Those who have grieved the Holy Spirit by their disobedience and/or unbelief have quenched the working of the Holy Spirit in their lives. They are still saved but being disobedient believers they do not experience the power of the Holy Spirit working through them. True repentance in humility restores the working of the Holy Spirit in one's life. |
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